No More Labels
In early March 2004 a mailing was made to all alumni from Warrendale, PA 15086. The nature of the mailing was a survey. Alumni were asked to send their responses to the alumni office. There were 1214 responses. Lee Strayer was responsible for this mailing and Lee was reimbursed about $3,000 from the Milton Hershey School Alumni Association.
In late July 2004, a mailing was made to all alumni from Manheim, PA. The nature of the mailing was a survey. Alumni were asked to send their responses to Bill Brill at my Maryland address. There were 1018 responses. I paid Stiegel Printing to do the printing and mailing and I was not reimbursed by anyone. And I did not get any database from Stiegel Printing.
For three consecutive Homecoming elections (Homecoming 2004, 2005 and 2006), MHSAA had “spirited” elections. The name “VoR”, standing for Voice of Reason, became known in 2004. The name “DtD”, standing for Defend the Deed, became known in 2005. During this time the Alumni database was available to anyone who made a proper request of MHSAA. Lee Strayer made such a request and so did I. I no longer use any database given to me my MHSAA.
During these election cycles, Lee Strayer was very involved in the support of the “DtD” candidates and I was very involved in the support of the “VoR” candidates.
Under oath, and in the presence of lawyers from both sides, on October 17, 2006, I testified to the Court the outcome of these three elections. The cumulative results show that 16 candidates who had the “VoR” label were winners whereas 1 candidate who had the “DtD” label was victorious.
Chuck Welsh said it best in his presentation at the MHSAA Annual Business meeting in September 2006 when he said,
“You have, no doubt, heard from the two competing groups who have emerged from this ongoing internal dispute. One group is known as the Voice of Reason, the other Defend the Deed. In an effort to point out the absurdity of some of the notions associated with these two groups, I submit the following:
Just because you are with the Voice of Reason doesn’t mean that you don’t want to “defend the deed.” Just because you side with Defend the Deed doesn’t mean that you can’t speak with a “voice of reason.”
Being aligned with the Voice of Reason doesn’t mean that you oppose legal standing for the Association. A Defend the Deed follower doesn’t necessarily want the Association to run the school.
VOR alumni don’t necessarily believe that the school’s administration is doing everything right, nor do all Defend the Deeders believe they are doing everything wrong.
Not every follower of the Voice of Reason is seeking a position with the school, and Defend the Deed people don’t think that a healthy HERCO is a bad thing.
As you can see, there is enough common ground among these competing groups to indicate that we ought to be able to reach a settlement on the issues that divide us. This dispute will not, however, be resolved by the extremists on both sides who respond to each other with hatred, anger and paranoia. It won’t be settled by “going behind the barn”…or the Supply Center parking lot for that matter. It will be resolved by forward-thinking, focused Alumni who are tolerant of other points of view and are able to put those differences aside for the good of our organization, and more importantly, for the benefit of the students at Milton Hershey School.
There is too much talent among us to allow this dispute to continue to render us impotent. We are engineers, accountants, lawyers, doctors, military leaders and teachers. We are mechanics, carpenters, skilled craftsmen and computer experts. And whatever we are, the one thing we have in common is we owe everything to the incredible beneficence of our founders.
We owe it to them to fix this, and we cannot wait any longer.”
As far as I know, the label “VoR” died shortly thereafter.
this sounds like you're turning it into some sort of fantasy playing out... 
Can we change that to tequila and put some curlers in my hair??? 
She is Bad Santa's Wife, she doesn't have to do anything except sit home, drink whisky, and cuss at the little kids walking by her house.
Just maybe, I think I could pull it off. Bad Santa's Wife doesn't have to bake dumb cookies right?
Gibbles, if they were to produce a Bad Santa's Wife, do you think they would ask you to play the part? 
Gibbles, if they were to produce a Bad Santa's Wife, do you think they would ask you to play the part?
Ya think?
I'm sure Gilbbles is a fine person though wish she'd endure a bit of my shooting from the hip in order to better understand the facts.
Gibbles, if they were to produce a Bad Santa's Wife, do you think they would ask you to play the part?
Actually, that previous spat had not too much to do with my opinion here. You were doing great at the beginning of the thread with your points and questions. Then you went on yet another spastic-Lee-ism and lost me.
Oh and I'm still a Gibbles112 and I'm pretty sure LexiPro can't cure it nor would I want it to.
Me? A bully? Sorry girl but I'll not let you kick me into a defensive mode because you're wrong. Providing facts or asking questions to learn the facts is not being a bully.
Face it, it doesn't matter what I say to you regardless if it's right, wrong or indifferent. Your early issues with me and that of others caused them to be against me...period. Release your emotions...try LexiPro.
Are you related to Billy-Bob?
! I can't believe you guys can blow that much hot air in just a few days! I can't even read it all without getting a headache. So instead of reading the full 3 hr miniseries I have a question (or two).
Pro Bono = free services right? So if someone offers services for free then why would they go an ask for payment? I don't get it. Now, If John agreed to do the work Pro Bono then I don't think he has any right to sue the employer for payment. HOWEVER, if the firm agreed to do the work Pro Bono and sent John to do the work then I would think he should be paid by his employer. $3.5M though????? That is just plain ludicrous. Plus! If John knew this was being done Pro Bono and with his affiliation with MHS (and such loyalty, ::dripping with sarcasm there:: )....why would he then sue for payment? Which then makes me repeat....$3.5M though????? That is just plain ludicrous.
Oh and Lee.....sorry they pegged you right...your a verbal bully and you taunt people to answer your empty questions just so you can blast back at them even further. I really don't think you want an answer. You just want a chance to verify that someone you don't like or agree with is on this site and reading your angry mental farts so you can just scream at them even more. I'm definitely sensing a serious Napoleon complex. I'm sure they have therapy for this.
Thank you so much for that explanation! That really helps some of us to understand what is/has been going on. It's ALL about the kids, and anyone who has ulterior motives for personal gain needs to hit the road.
this thread is in the debate club area of this forum... some things that are discussed do not necessarily include the students. But when some of us see some people playing loose with the MHS Trust, and also we see some people who support those who do play loose with the MHS Trust, we tend to speak out. I know you are one person who is trying to determine if what has been stated on this site, supports the children, well in the long run I say it does.
If you [general use of the term you] allow the continued inappropriate tapping of the MHS Trust to occur unchallenged, then you allow for precedence and/or continued drain on the MHS Trust for purposes for which the MHS Trust was NOT established.
There exist many who want a portion of the MHS Trust pie, and will stop at nothing to get their piece. The children are the reason why people speak out against the potential diversion away from the intended purpose of MHS Trust assets.
I for one spoke out loudly against the establishment of H or L Block housing [30-40 children per home] and felt that those in charge of the MHS Trust [MHS BOM] did not properly represent Milton and Catherine Hershey's wishes in their plans to build such dormitory or barracks style housing. I was very happy to see those plans abandoned. There exist others who went even further to change the mindset of those who have the ultimate decision in determing such usage of MHS Trust assets.
The abandonment of building such type of housing may not have happended if not for external pressures placed upon the MHS BOM, via press releases and/or political pressure at the local and state levels. Please know that these people, who have asked for nothing in return [or for MHS Trust assets] for themselves, have a value system that needs to be appreciated over those who keep seeking assets for themsleves in their decision making actions related to certain goals. Please begin to be wary of those who seek such opportunities for asset expenditures that have an ultimate and underlying plan to line their own pockets [or family members' pockets] with riches gained from the MHS Trust.
Some alumni believe those who spoke out against such misconceived ideas of funds expenditure, have violated allegiance to the current MHS administrators. In reality, no such allegiance should be held, it isn't the MHS administration that we [alumni] should feel bound to uphold, but rather the intent of the MHS Trust, as portayed in Milton and Catherine Hershey's writing of the document. The MHS administrators, in my opinion, are only employees of the MHS Trist and the MHS BOM have the ultimate duty to uphold the MHS Trust regardless of any plan proposed by anyone subordinate to their authority! The MHS BOM [and PA OAG] are ultimately responsible for the expenditures and delving out of the MHS Trust assets, even when discussing such issues as ROI on the HERCO investments and proper managing of The Hershey Company decisions, and the MHS itself.
The MHS BOM have the decision making duties and the PA OAG has the ultimate say in ensuring the MHS BOM make wise decisions regarding the proper implementation of the MHS Trust. The MHSAA BOD has been informed through lgeal decisions that they have no standing in such matters, so when you read a current MHSAA BOD member spouting that he/she will take action to move forward with issues related to the MHS Trust and present them to the MHS BOD and then to the MHS BOM, please know that the individual who thinks in this manner has abandoned his/her senses because he/she no longer holds a true concept of his/her authority, and probably overstates his/her position within the infastructure.
When you read that certain members of the MHSAA have taken steps to address issues with the PA OAG or through the courts, please know they fully understand the position from which they speak.
In winding up my long winded response to your post, please know that sometimes the picture is clouded when trying to determine who benefits from certain decsions. On the surface it may appear to beneift children, when in fact some decisions benefit construction companies, support services companies and companies who wish to possess valued land in the Township of Derry.
There exists a long history of MHS Trust asset diversion, some alumni have challenged those who have gained much from such actions. The MHS BOM have not always made decsions in the best interest of the MHS Trust beneficiaries [the MHS children], so please be careful when you try to determine if a specific decision regarding asset expenditure benefits children.
I thank you for providing me with sufficient information that verifies the information of which I will be searching doesn't reside in any of the 2002-2006 MHSAA BOD minutes or in the last of the 2001 MHSAA BOD minutes. So if Halbleib were to be telling the truth, the information will reside in the 1999 - 2001 MHSAA BOD minutes. That sure does narrow down the search.
Sincerely,
I have not yet posted any comments regarding this disagreement. Quite honestly I do not know all the details in order to make an informed decision on the matter. However, I do know this... If there are changes or events taking place at MHS one would assume that they are in the best interest of the kids. Alot has changed over the course of time since Milton Hershey's death. I am very conservative by nature and cling to traditional values and ideas. But...if a change means the advancement of or bettering the chances of success for the kids at MHS then these new ideas should be at the very least evaluated. On the other hand, if they are a means to line the pockets of greedy or selfish individuals with a personal agenda then these ideas have no place in the rearing process of the kids that Milton Hershey was so dedicated in helping. After all the hoopla and mumbo-jumbo...let both sides on this issue take a breath and ask the simple but important question...ARE THE KIDS BENEFITTING? Perhaps there are items on both sides of the argument that could be intertwined so that the best of both worlds would suit the kids best.
If you truly understood the mission of our benefactor, his history and Deed of Trust...you'd not see this as "squabbling", rather, an effort by some to bring about reform of MHS and its BOM versus the other side who, in many cases, want everything to continue on business as usual due to their personal and/or professional self-serving interests. No need to go into the detail because it can be found on many websites.
And, those of us in support of MHS/BOM are doing far more than "squabbling" if that's how you still choose to label it. And, we're doing it not only because of what Mr. Hershey did for each of us but because he's 6' under ground and needs his children to support his agenda...not personal and/or professional self-serving ones.
I hope this makes some sense to you. Please note, that in all the years of so-called "squabbling", never...EVER could anyone affiliated with BOM/MHS reform be accused of doing so for self-serving reasons whereas the other side often is. That alone should paint most of the picture for you.
After all...if you were worth a few million and had in your will that you want all your money to go to your children...don't you think it should? Or do you think it would be okay for someone to come along and do something else with your money? In many respects, at least to me, it's that simple. Mr. Hershey's Deed of Trust should be adhered to with his core mission implemented.
Here's a quick example. My wife's father was the Executor of a very close friend who died two years ago. She was a true hoarder of money but, hey...so what...it belonged to her. Anyhow, at the age of 89, living in southern Florida, she became ill and had to be put in hospital for several months before dying. During that time, some folks who represented Hospice were visiting her. After she died, they presented a hand-written change in her will that they claimed she made. They also had taken the key to her house along with the key to her bank box. They cleaned it out. My father-in-law was reluctant to do anything but I reminded him that she made him the Executor to take care of things according to her will because since she was 6' under there was no way she could. He did...and, after hiring lawyers that cost a bundle, still got most of the deceased belongings back. It just blew me away that what was so obvious had to be handled in such a legally-correct way that it cost stress, anxieties along with lots of wasted time and money. Unbelieveable!
Become involved in the squabbling? For what reason?!
Steve...if you TRULY knew the FACTS you wouldn't make the comment you did. Become involved...after all, Mr. Hershey did quite a bit for you, me and all other alumni and we owe it to him.
Is driving many people away from ever wanting to have anything to do with helping with the leadership of the school in any way. And I'm not busting one side anymore than the other, they are both equally doing it together. It's really getting childish..... this airing of the schools business in the local papers is utterly embarrassing! I believe it shows it is more of a personal vendetta, than any concern what so ever for the good of MHS.
Hater Brill:
Who died and left you AG, MHS President, or BOM Chairman? Where do you get off presuming any capacity that would require us to bring our "concerns" to you, Heist, or the other clowns masquerading as MHSAA leaders? What do any of you fools know that we don't or that we have not told you for years? When do you do anything other than repeat the Founders Hall party line, in your collective and obsequious effort to suck up, no matter how many children, houseparents, or other employees are hurt by appalling policies?
Consider yourselves lucky that I don't take the time to write a more thorough response.
Someday, you and the other jackasses will be exposed for exactly what you are -- i.e., shills for despicable people who experiment with 20-child bedrooms, line their pockets with childcare money, give jobs and contracts to cronies, subject needy children to the contemptible policies of an impostor who has for decades lied about his "masters degree" (and appears to be driving the child-crowding lunacy that the Zimmerman-BOM is endorsing), and otherwise have made a complete and total mockery of the Trust's child-saving and sole lawful mission.
And if you or the other losers dispute even one syllable of what I've written here, don't "invite" me to one of your fake "meetings" ("presided" over by the likes of Heist, of all the embarrassments to "lead" MHSAA). Instead, set up two microphones at a public gathering, and I will be more than happy to expose the whole pack of you before anyone in attendance. We can even video-stream it on the Internet to assure that more people see you all for what you are.
I know you won't take up this offer -- but I will continue to repeat it periodically, to make sure that everyone paying any attention at all knows exactly what you're about, "AG Hater Brill."
Ric Fouad
HIS/MHS Class of 1980
This whole back and forth conversation is making my nuts hurt.
The "Ask the Board" feature has been added.
thank you, you have been very helpful. If there is anything I can do to assist the MHSAA, and I have the means to accomplish the task, I will do my best.
I was trying to be helpful by suggesting where you might find information. Nothing more! Nothing less!
I don't see anywhere that I referred to the 1999 minutes. I'm sorry you interpreted it that way. I read the minutes and meeting agendas for 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005 and 2006. The 2002 records had the minutes for the last 2001 Board meeting. My remarks refer to those years.
Joe Berning was not the 1999 MHSAA Secretary nor the 1999 MHSAA President, so I would not turn to Joe for the official repository information; but I do appreciate that you have acknowledged and recognized him as being the person who would have correct information. When I see a thread [or even a single post] that he authors, I usually read it thoroughly because he is usually spot on with his assessment of facts and individuals, as was the case on the thread you mentioned in which I participated previously. Thank you for confirming his assessment.
The 'Ask the Board' concept sounds like a great idea, and I support such a concept - in concept - it should provide a wonderful avenue for the membership to interface with the MHSAA BOD.
Thank you!
What I know about the achievements of the 1999 Board is very positive. Because of the collective efforts of many, the Trust was spared the expenditures of “hundreds of millions of dollars.” I see no reason for the 1999 Board to hide any information. In fact, presented from a business perspective, it would have been easy to justify 3.5M in costs in order to save hundreds of millions of dollars – if that, in fact, were the case.
It is sad to say that there has been no consistency of MHSAA minutes. Sometimes Executive Committee minutes exist; sometimes they don’t. Sometimes Board meeting minutes are detailed; sometimes they look like the agenda with almost no information. I believe that I have found Board actions that are not in the minutes. There are some Board meetings for which there are no minutes. There may be Board actions between meetings - by the Executive Committee - that do not end up in the minutes. Who would know? How can anyone be positive that something that was voted upon will end up in the minutes?
Since I have been Secretary all the Board minutes are on the website. They have all been moved to the new website. I have included every Board action in the minutes. Our Board meetings sometimes last four hours long – as such I try to limit the number of pages to six. Sometimes the Board rehashes the same old stuff – I tend to not repeat it in the minutes.
So, in summary, and the primary reason I suggested that you go ahead – without me -, is that at the end of the day I am not sure what will be found. There may be a single email that was “floated” that has the answer!
Bill,
You have stated my case exactly. If the board had voted to approve... The one part that is speculative remains the word "if". I believe that "if" the board had approved such a decision for John Halbleib/[or his former employer] they would have documented the decision [via the vote] in the minutes. If something of this magnitude had been voted upon, it would have ended up in the minutes. I have faith in the 199 MHSAA BOD sceretary, in that such a vote would have bene documented.
The other part that I disagree with you centers on the 1999 minutes. I believe the secretary was consistent throughout the 1999 MHSAA BOD. I recommend you not cast stones at the 1999 secretary for being less than effective.
No problem. the ability to edit your own comments is not set by a time limit anymore, it is now set to lock after someone has replied to that comment. I think that is a good compromise. Don't you?
Give it a bit of time...thanks.
No problem. the ability to edit your own comments is not set by a time limit anymore, it is now set to lock after someone has replied to that comment. I think that is a good compromise. Don't you?
I am pretty sure I have explained this to you personally before, if not I hope this clears it up.
You see when a certain user decided he was going to leave he went on a tirade before he left and went through and started deleting his posts along with all the comments that others left along with them. So I put a time limit on the ability to edit posts.
and thanks for re-explaining; however, that happened to only one person so I'd suggest allowing posters to edit whenever...at least for a few days rather than a few minutes.
I am pretty sure I have explained this to you personally before, if not I hope this clears it up.
You see when a certain user decided he was going to leave he went on a tirade before he left and went through and started deleting his posts along with all the comments that others left along with them. So I put a time limit on the ability to edit posts.
I only have very limited access, to edit "cuss words" pretty much..
If an MHSAA Board and/or one or more of its members sued you...would you feel the same way? If you and your family were physically threatened by those in support of MHSAA Board members...would you feel the same way?
Would you find MHSAA Board members honorable?
I came back to edit my post but the "edit" button had disappeared. Strange how things like this happens. As the mod Steve, do you know why?
I'm simply saying, it's like being on the front line in a war and seeing 10 of your buddies jump up from the trenches and run 10 feet and get shot, and standing up knowing your chances of making it are slim to none but doing it anyway.
I know very little about the situation, but from what I have read so far, if someone asked me to run for office I would look like this 
, yet knowing that they are going to be under a microscope they do it anyway, the only person I know is Mary Mc D. (and I only know her from seeing her in the hallway at school, never talked to her) Lee I have not been back to MHS in 20 years. I, up until 6 months ago was completely by choice disconnected from anything Hershey.
Please don't try to dissect my words like I'm trying to hide meanings in my sentences like a record played backwards. I'm simply trying to be a simple peacekeeper, it's just my nature. I do not get into the "politics" and do NOT want to be. Cool?
If you're so "impartial"...how can you then be partical in claiming "... the serving members all the more honorable in my opinion."...especially after you don't know the "whole story"?
I appreciate your wanting to see all resolved and start over again...and, believe it or not, I do too. Yet, far more important to me is BOM/MHS reform whereas with others, their importance is self-serving interests, in my opinion.
If an MHSAA Board and/or one or more of its members sued you...would you feel the same way? If you and your family were physically threatened by those in support of MHSAA Board members...would you feel the same way?
Would you find MHSAA Board members honorable?
I came back to edit my post but the "edit" button had disappeared. Strange how things like this happens. As the mod Steve, do you know why?
I'm not choosing sides here because I don't know the whole story of what happened. I'm just stating an impartial opinion. I understand some horrible things happened..... but there has to be a starting point to getting it resolved.
cha-ching... 2 cents deposited. Keep the change. Because we need change greatly. There are to many great minds in the MHSAA not being used because they dislike each other over this. And it really is sad!
If an MHSAA Board and/or one or more of its members sued you...would you feel the same way? If you and your family were physically threatened by those in support of MHSAA Board members...would you feel the same way?
Would you find MHSAA Board members honorable?
After all that has taken place and the "heat" that surrounds the whole issue, the fact that anyone would "want" to serve on the MHSAA board "without fear of feeling like they are under a microscope 24/7" make the serving members all the more honorable in my opinion. It is sad that any of this happened, but it really needs to be resolved (legally) and put behind "us collectively" so the MHSAA board (current and future) can move ahead and stop looking behind at this situation. When you are always trying to move forward while always looking behind you... you don't move very far forward. A good arbitrator/mediator is greatly needed to get this resolved and put to bed for good! To many hours/days/years have been wasted bickering over this.
cha-ching... 2 cents deposited. Keep the change. Because we need change greatly. There are to many great minds in the MHSAA not being used because they dislike each other over this. And it really is sad!
Don,
What I know about the achievements of the 1999 Board is very positive. Because of the collective efforts of many, the Trust was spared the expenditures of “hundreds of millions of dollars.” I see no reason for the 1999 Board to hide any information. In fact, presented from a business perspective, it would have been easy to justify 3.5M in costs in order to save hundreds of millions of dollars – if that, in fact, were the case.
It is sad to say that there has been no consistency of MHSAA minutes. Sometimes Executive Committee minutes exist; sometimes they don’t. Sometimes Board meeting minutes are detailed; sometimes they look like the agenda with almost no information. I believe that I have found Board actions that are not in the minutes. There are some Board meetings for which there are no minutes. There may be Board actions between meetings - by the Executive Committee - that do not end up in the minutes. Who would know? How can anyone be positive that something that was voted upon will end up in the minutes?
Since I have been Secretary all the Board minutes are on the website. They have all been moved to the new website. I have included every Board action in the minutes. Our Board meetings sometimes last four hours long – as such I try to limit the number of pages to six. Sometimes the Board rehashes the same old stuff – I tend to not repeat it in the minutes.
So, in summary, and the primary reason I suggested that you go ahead – without me -, is that at the end of the day I am not sure what will be found. There may be a single email that was “floated” that has the answer!
Thank you for the information posted. The potential trial of which you speak, has nothing to do with my inquiry. I'm just trying to determine if any prior MHSAA BOD had indeed, as John Halbleib has conveyed to me, approved his/[his former employer] filing for $3.5M from the MHS Trust, for services rendered by him/[his former employer]for the 'pro bono' billable hours.
I doubt that any such information resides in the MHSAA BOD minutes, but I could be wrong. I would think that if any such approval would have been provided by a prior MHSAA BOD, that information would have been documented in the minutes, due to the vote that would have occurred. Additionally I believe that the MHSAA BOD of 1999 [or any MHSAA BOD between 1999 and 2004] would have announced such a decision.
I do not believe that the 1999 MHSAA BOD [or any MHSAA BOD between 1999 and 2004] would have hidden that information from the alumni at large. Do you?
Thank you!
Sincerely,
For whatever reason you want to chase down information before the trial - assuming there is one - go right ahead. My suggestion - as a resource for any information - is Joe Berning. He was on the Board at that time.
The Executive Committee will be discussing a concept of "Ask the Board" as part of the new website. It is intended to respond to questions regarding MHSAA business.
I will also bring to the Executive Committee's attention your concern re pro bono.
The last I knew the minutes were kept in the alumni office. Since I have been Secretary I send a copy in every month and they become part of the Board packet. Individual Board members may keep all kinds of records that they amassed while on the Board. There apparently is no obligation to turn your records in or to throw them away. I suspect that you have a near neighbor in Hummelstown who probably has everything and may have been on the Board during the time that you are interested. Good luck!
p.s. If this is "hit and run" so be it.
p.p.s This thread has had no effect on Lee. He is now using the term "VoR" on the new MHSAA website. Losers remorse! Ya think!
I'm responding to this post - because I believe you had intended this statement to be directed to me. Please excuse me if I'm incorrect. I was hoping you would be one of my witnesses. If I schedule an appointment to review the minutes, I will invite you to observe, are you willing to serve in that capacity? I, of course reserve the right to invite another witness, just to keep things fair and balanced. Thank you!
During my term as a director, I answered all questions directed towards me regarding MHSAA BOD issues. I never failed to respond to questions regarding MHSAA business. I'm sure though you may have a different thought process regarding your duties.
P.S. - I do not intend to show up for the MHSAA BOD meetings, I am no longer on the board and have faith in your word, regarding your statement that you will represent my issues regarding the new Bylaws related to Article VI - ['pro bono'].
P.P.S. - The bylaws are quite clear in regard to the obligation of turning in information. The only near neighbor I have in Hummelstown that might fit your description may be John O'Toole, but I'm not sure he was on the MHSAA BOD during the 1999 timeframe, is that the person to whom you are referring? Please advise! Thank you!
I agree.
this is getting childish.... anyone have anything important to say? needs another move---debate club to trash can.
please stop while we still respect most of you...
Lee,
Don wrote the following,
“I don't need to tag team with anyone! Please just respond to me in a separate post in the future, that way you can keep our conversation just between the two of us. Thank you!”
That is what I did.
Lee Strayer attemped to deflect questions and criticisms of his behavior.
Bill: In my opinion your comments are sometimes “misconstrued” ....STOP the baiting! Enough said…end of story!!!
Of course I'm not surprised by this from Billy-Bob. He's entitled to his opinion yet his apparent calumny doesn't strike me as an "opinion". Allowing someone to initiate such comments with no response may cause others to eventually believe what a likely "unbalanced lunatic" is saying. It sure appears to me that Billy-Bob is baiting...again.
As I read his comments, it seemed he slam dunks both Sonny Jenkins and Don Chappell but might have realized it could have backfired on him so he now tells all what most already know...that Sonny and Don have "...done a great deal for MHSAA" and that both "...have been two of the real "workaholics" for the Alumni Association." Note, however, his key words..."HAVE BEEN" as in past tense.
Actually Billy-Bob, both continue to be "workaholics" for alumni but never in the self-serving way a few others have likely been. Oh, by the way, if the shoe fits Billy-Bob, wear it.
Would a demitasse fit your head like a sombrero? You know Billy-Bob, I've had many cases of puppy love for townie girls when I was in the home that was just infatuation, but this disgust I feel for you is the real thing. Ordinarily people live and learn. You seem to just live, in my opinion.
Now please, Billy-Bob, stop the baiting. You got your reply to your so-called "invitation" of me to your next MHSAA/VoR meeting. Case closed! And should anyone wish to read it, go to: www.miltonhersheyforums.org. Why did I reply there? Because Billy-Bob posted his invitation publicly on this website with it being the ONLY topic I've ever seen on here where one could NOT "add (a) new comment". As a result, making a reply was impossible, thanks to Billy-Bob.
I do not want my remarks to Sonny Jenkins misconstrued. Sonny has done a great deal for MHSAA over the past number of years. He and Don Chappell have been two of the real “workaholics” for the Alumni Association.
Lee Strayer attemped to deflect questions and criticisms of his behavior.
Lee Strayer has responded to the invitation to come to the next MHSAA Board meeting and he said "no."
It is very disappointing that a small "splinter" group of alumni will refuse to sit down, in an "open" forum, to discuss the enrollment and retention information. Perhaps, as important, is their unwillingness to talk about how alumni could help recruit and retain students.
I have been “on the clock” too long with you and have answered more than my fair share of questions from you and Lee and now Sonny and it never ends. I always enjoy jostling with those who did not vote for me. It is time for me to get on with my other MHSAA responsibilities. It’s been fun and I do hope you show up at the next Board meeting.
The last I knew the minutes were kept in the alumni office. Since I have been Secretary I send a copy in every month and they become part of the Board packet. Individual Board members may keep all kinds of records that they amassed while on the Board. There apparently is no obligation to turn your records in or to throw them away. I suspect that you have a near neighbor in Hummelstown who probably has everything and may have been on the Board during the time that you are interested. Good luck!
p.s. If this is "hit and run" so be it.
p.p.s This thread has had no effect on Lee. He is now using the term "VoR" on the new MHSAA website. Losers remorse! Ya think!
Excerpt from Bill Brill post 10/16/2008 5:27 pm
"Don – aren’t you a logistician? If you don’t have a report and you haven’t seen a report, how can you conclude what is in the report or what is not in the report? Nice try. Concerning the money, you again display poor logic. Ask the source (Lee) and quit worrying about who reported it. Ask Lee to deny it."
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I do not even have a clue what to ask Lee. I didn't include him in my responses to you, you included him in your response to me. Please provide some guidance on what I'm supposed to ask him. As a matter of fact, using your logic, ask him yourself, why have me ask him, you are the one who holds interest with this issue.
As far as my logic regarding the minutes, you currently sit on the MHSAA BOD and have complete access to the minutes. If you can't locate any information detailed in the circa 1999 MHSAA minutes [or any other era] that support John Halblieb's statement regarding the MHSAA BOD approving his/[or his former employer's] action to recover $3.5M from the MHS Trust for the billable hours rendered to the MHSAA via 'pro bono' support, then I am not surprised. I simply believe that such information just does not exist.
If you can provide me access to the minutes, I will gladly search through them and determine if John Halbleib's statement holds any truth. Let me know if you can schedule such an appointment, I will attempt to bring along a witness to confirm the findings. I do not anticipate my search will result in a positive finding of that information. If I am wrong however, I will gladly post such a result on this forum.
I don't need to tag team with anyone! Please just respond to me in a separate post in the future, that way you can keep our conversation just between the two of us. Thank you!
Sincerely,
Are you kidding? I live it! ROFL. Although, I still clean some, I'm domestically inept so this whole bad Mrs Claus sorta works for me. Ask the bratty kids down the street, they don't come down here since I scared the crap out of them over the summer when I found them throwing the neighbors gravel near my car
Not sure that kid got that stain out of his pants! 